With release quickly coming upon us, tell us non beta users your opinions on all 3 sides. Which ones better for rushing, better navy, better air, better end game or any other advantages/disadvantages each side has. Thanks.
Nice thread idea. Ok here goes my opinion on the matter. I'm a UEF player mainly so I'll probably go into a lot of detail on them, and say what I can about Cybran and Aeon.
For the most part they're a blend of "middle of the road" in respects to the amount of damage their firepower does on average, coupled with "overpowered" in terms of their T3 units and other late game abilities/units. Generally their units have the most hitpoints of the three sides.
They have the best siege bot, the best aerial unit (T3 gunship, I won't go into detail you can find that info in other threads).
Their navy is powerful in terms of their destroyers and battleships, but their cruisers and lower tiered units are rather weak by comparison. Generally their ships have the highest HP but tend to not put out as much damage as you'd hope, with the exception of the battleship and the destroyer if it's turned broadside.
Their accuracy is also generally middle of the road. Artillery units are powerful, but not always accurate, again, middle of the road.
The commander and SCU's have many good and helpful upgrades giving them some interesting versatility, though they generally don't do as well combat-wise as compared to the other two factions. Overall you won't get much in the way of "craziness" from the UEF, no real exotic things like the Cybran walking destroyer or the Aeon engineers sacrificing themselves.
In terms of experimentals the UEF has good, but sometimes hard to deploy choices. 1) The Fatboy is a powerful unit with awesome firepower and the ability to build a small T2 army for you, as well as refuel aircraft or travel underwater. It's only drawback is that it's a glass cannon, it won't survive a serious attack on it, but that's why it has the long range nasty guns. It's AA coverage sucks big time so it has to depend on other units. 2) The Atlantis is the single most powerful naval unit in the game in terms of being able to go 1 on 1 with any other naval unit and sink it. Has alot of HP to give it some survivability and obviously operates as a carrier (which is relatively useless overall). Has good AA defenses though when surfaced. 3) The Mavor is the super cannon of the game. Able to lob a ton of devastating shells at a target in rapid succession. It's drawback is that it's weak, stationary, and takes forever to build and is very expensive. However this will be different on larger maps and it could in fact be yet another "overpowered-feather" in the UEF's cap.
UEF's main weaknesses that I see are generally weak point defense as well as having the weakest AA defenses. However this is more than made up for by the fact that, once out of Tech Level 1, they're able to project brutal degrees of firepower. As said before, I won't go into it, but they could use "re-balancing" / "nerfing" / whatever you want to call it in certain areas to make things a bit better. Lastly I don't play the UEF because I found them to be overpowered in many areas, I play them because they were the side that most appealed to me long before I ever got to play the game. I enjoy their look, feel, and background.
The red-headed stepchildren of the game. Very cool concept and look to them, but very odd execution and a general lack of logic that leaves you saying "why......?" when you play/examine them.
Generally many of their units cost more and have a longer build time than the other two factions........and end up being significantly weaker than them. Lowest HP of the three factions generally. They lack mobile shield generators and currently stealth isn't all it's cracked up to be (more on that later). Their shield structures have an annoying and painful upgrade process, not to mention being very expensive, you then get the payoff of having the weakest shields with the most power to run them (this goes back to my "why....?" thing).
In T1 they're currently very good, and apparently overpowered, but once you get out of T1 it's pretty downhill from there. I don't mean to say that in the sense that you're guaranteed to lose, but you're gonna have to put forth a hell of a lot more effort than the other two factions.
Their artillery SUCKS SUCKS SUCKS. Highly innacurate, shortest range, and least damage of the three. This is supposed to be made up for by apparently having the largest area of effect, but in practice it just doesnt work out. A general problem with all Cybran units is that they also tend to do the least damage per hit when compared to the other factions. This is somewhat made up for by the fact that their units shoot faster and are generally more accurate, but still remains a thorn in their side. Coupled with the fact that laser weapons can very easily end up slamming into the ground more than the target and you can have some hair pulling moments. Supcom was supposed to not have alot of micro, but these units can require you to double check the terrain to make sure you can even hit the target. The other factions dont suffer from this anywhere near as much.
One bonus I've recently discovered is that their air defenses and T1 PD are essentially the best out of the three factions. Their T2 tactical missile launcher is also the best now that it has been fixed. It's able to rapidly fire all 5 of its missiles, much faster than the other two factions' launchers. Giving you a great hail of nasty damage. Cybran torpedo launchers do a hellacious amount of damage compared to the other two factions and are actually quite useful.
On the topic of stealth. It has been helped alot to have the omni-sensor's omni range reduced. This helps alot with mobile units and the like. The current problem which causes Cybran to suffer along with the other factions is that the stealth generators don't help as much as you'd like. Sure they keep everything in its radius off the radar, but unfortunately all it takes to eliminate this is one little scout plane or what have you and it's all visible. Ya the enemy wont see movement or anything like that, but they know what buildings are there and can direct artillery fire, or whatever as needed. This hurts the Cybran more cause they're meant to rely on stealth to a greater extent than the other factions. If stealth generators completely "wiped" radar contacts as well as "recon information" from the game then they'd be pretty effective and actually go a good way towards allowing players to setup secret bases and keep things secret even when the enemy flies over them. Would force more scouting and actually force players to go in and destroy the generators to see what's there.
Cybran are characterized by having the "can do" attitude and being versatile. Sadly this just doesn't play out as well as it should. Things like the walking destroyer and T3 bots ability to redirect missiles are cool in theory, but turn out to be rarely seen and not very helpful gimmicks when games are actually played. Yes Cybran units are the fastest of the three factions, but it's not a fast enough speed to truely allow them to engage in hit and run attacks, the only exception to this might be the mantis. Oddly enough, the Aeon have the fastest scout.
Cybran ACU's and SCU's can be absolute nightmares however, easily the most deadly of the three factions in terms of combat. If you've ever read DeadMG's posts, you know how he likes to go on about how he upgrades his commander, and it's true. Fully upgraded the Cybran commander is an invisible high powered death machine that can melt units to slag with a weaker (yet still potent) version of the Monkeylord's heat ray. It's only drawback is that it's truly only useful in defense as any decent opponent will have an omni-sensor up and nullify your invisibility. SCU's on the other hand are insane. They can be made invisible as well, however they also have a repair upgrade that causes their hitpoints to skyrocket like crazy when damaged. This makes them ridiculously tough to kill as they can absorb a ton of damage and repair it in the blink of an eye. On top of this they do very high damage as well as having an EMP upgrade that is the only instance in the game of a stun weapon being highly effective (IMHO). It's able to instantly render any non-experimental unit completely immobile and incapable of firing back. These guys are nice and nasty.
As for experimentals, Cybran benefit by having the most cost effective and all around useful experimentals of the three factions. The Monkeylord is a great unit, offering great all around firepower, defenses, stealth, and mobility. It has great AA, a devastating heat ray, and is amphibious and capable of firing torpedoes. The Soul Ripper is also a good all around unit. A heavily armored gunship, good mobility and relatively cheap to build. If it has a weakness it would be that it could use yet another firepower boost. Lastly the Scathis is a fun little unit if you can get the energy to power it. It suffers from being slow, low HP, and highly innacurate, doesn't do much damage on a "per shot" basis, but the idea is to rain a ton of fire on the enemy. It doesnt have very long range however so on larger maps you'll need to either move it in closer where it's less likely to be as well defended, or you won't be able to hit many areas of the map. Not amphibious.
Overall Cybran experimentals are cheap to build meaning that it's not as "big of a deal" as it is with Aeon or UEF to either get one up and running or to lose it. A Cybran player can be expected to send multiple experimentals at an opponent either all at once or over the course of a game.
Aeon can best be characterized as generally having middle of the road HP and doing the highest damage per shot, though usually with a longer reload time. In some cases; T3 bot, T2 gunship, Galactic Collossus, their units have the most HP when compared to their opposites.
Aeon are generally in a good place. Their high damage and decent HP helps them out alot in many situations and having the most powerful shields and artillery really let them put the hurt on somebody. Alot of their stuff is actually quite cheap in comparison which could be a bit questionable. Generally they're described as specialists in that their units usually do one thing and do it well.
Their navy is sometimes considered the most powerful. They do the most damage per shot, but don't have the highest HP like the UEF. Their ships generally win in a 1v1 against the other factions, with the exception that the UEF battleship is pretty much a match if not more powerful than the Aeon battleship. Their ships generally lack AA fire, so this is made up for by having a T1 attack boat who's only purpose is a highspeed mobile AA gun. Their cruisers are also good AA platforms.
A general weakness would probably be their air units. Their T2 gunship isn't anything to write home about, nor are their bombers. They aren't particularly weak, just not as effective as UEF or Cybran aircraft seem to be.
Aeon artillery on the other hand is insane. Highest damage with a DoT effect, and longest range. This adds a nice advantage for their side.
Their ACU has two Resource Allocations upgrades which give them a pretty powerful advantage. The SCU's RA is also very good compared to the other 2 factions. Combat wise they're not too bad either, but they shine more in having pretty strong shielding.
Aeon experimentals are "so-so". The Tempest is a nice little mobile naval factory, but it doesn't have the firepower to really be called an "experimental battleship". As for the Czar, well it's got very few decent uses and generally isn't worth building unfortunately. The Galactic Collossus is a great unit when it gets to do what it can do. The problem is getting it into range of enemy units. It has no AA defenses and its weaponry is short range. However having the most HP of any unit in the game and able to absolutely wreck enemy defenses makes it a great siege weapon. It's just gotta get in range to do its thing. Also it's very slow.
So that's pretty much all I can think of for the moment. If you've got more questions or if I think of anything I'll add it.
Good review... You might want to add that Aeon have really good t2 shield Gens. As well as t2 shield tanks that can be good for either prolonged sieges or hit and run tactics
I would but it doesn't let me edit my post anymore .
Looks like Dragonteeth did some editing to make it "purdier". Thanks Dragon!
I wish you could edit posts up to a day after they were made with a *edited last (date/time) instead of the place that says "new".
I guess GGM is toiling away on other things.
Scathis is good, If powerd (Like 30k now) its capable to crack turtelers open like nut shells it tears down shields and obliberates bases, only diffuculty is to get it in reach and there u have t2 and t3 units to protect it.
Scathis is IMHO(!) the 2nd best unit in game! (First comes the monkeylord, fearsome, fastmade & a devestating weapon.)
HOW EVER! The Cybran realy need some love. They need to get buffed up, AEON and UEF are practicly on equal foot but Cybran WICH OF Chris Taylor HIMSELF stated they where his favorites are left down with practicly the weakest units till u get to the experimentals. If u arent wiped out.
wow, really good info there, thanks for taking the time for doing that. Anyone else have any more input please post.
"Omg invisible spider?! HAX!" "WTF Wheres the spider! OMG! cheater!"
The scathis runs on 30k energy every 3 seconds.. so you can use storage to even this out into 10k energy every second. A single scathis can defeat many shields, and two scathises can defeat a hell of a lot. It takes something really big to properly defend a Scathis. Its probably the only weapon in the game that I would call a weapon of mass destruction. Even a nuke cant do as much damage over a period of time and costs much much more.
The Mantis is still a nice and good unit, but with the recent small nerf, its now not really as good as it should be, especially given the uselessness of our higher tiers.
One instance of the cybran Can Do attitude is the attack subs- ours come with a laser for destroying things on land. This makes them much more useful than standard subs in terms of all round usefulness. A monkeylord can fight back at absolutely any opponent, if not great against air.
The general tactic of the cybrans is information- you scout your opponent often and regularly, then use your units to dodge him somehow- for example, using your subs to dominate the seas, and then pop up and slaughter his attacks.
The Cybran tech2 PD has a great advantage in that it has an almost invisible projectile. This means that our PD hiding out of visual range can appear to be attacking from nowhere. However, one aerial scout and its game over.
UEF Tigershark class attack submarines have a deck gun as well.
Just clearing what these abbrevations mean. For new players.
ACU = Armored Command Unit. The main Commander unit you start the game with. SCU = Support Command Unit. These are like ACU but weaker. You can summon these through Tier 3 Quantum Gates.
A bog-standard Sub Commander is stronger than a basic ACU, you need to upgrade your ACU to keep useful throughout the game. "Omg invisible spider?! HAX!" "WTF Wheres the spider! OMG! cheater!"
SCUs are actually stronger, except for the Cybrans, since thier ACU can get a Microwave Beam.
Really? Well, I didn't put too much tought on that one.
Read: unupgraded. I would vouch for a properly upgraded ACU against a properly upgraded SCU every time, especially the Cybran ACU.
well there's stronger and theres stronger. ACU has the Overcharge trump-card against SCUs and experimentals, but the SCU will still wang more regular units and be tougher to kill and comes with a t3 engineering suite.
Hmm something I'm curious about...
Cybran SCU's can be upgraded with a very nasty EMP attack that basically stuns anything non-experimental. I wonder how well it works against ACU's if at all. Have you tried it out? Cause if you can stun the enemy commander he's toast.
It also must be said, in terms of Aesthetics, the UEF has a very modern day "Military" feel to it, the Cybran have a harsh, scary-looking feel(spikey and dark), and the Aeon are reminiscent of the new Battlestar Galactica's cylons, smooth, round, and silver.
The Aeons have pools of "quicksilver" which their buildings and units emerge from as a build animation(at the end, the quicksilver fades away revealing a spiral scarring on the ground), the Cybran use little flying bots with lasers to make their buildings, leaving a very cool criss-cross scarring on the ground. The UEF creates a blue block around where the building will be erected, then it 'carves' it out of the blue block.
This is very important stuff, you can modify your strategy around a faction, but you can't change how much you like each faction's looks!
you say "blue block"...I say Holographic Blueprint. Meh...
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ The Original Gaymer Dag
www.myspace.com/thechuk9
This article is pretty revealing from Chris Taylor's point of view. Though, I don't think that it all works this way in practice right now.
http://www.gamespot.com/pc/strategy/supremecommander/news.html?sid=6164791&om_act=convert&om_clk=newlyadded
"The UEF is the most traditional faction, and most players that are just starting out with the game might want to try this faction first. The factions are carefully balanced, but if you like a straight-ahead-style approach to battle, the UEF is a good choice. My favorite unit is the gunships, both at Tech 2 and Tech 3, as they move around the map quickly and can be used to wipe out your opponent's economy if you can sneak them in the back door."
"The Cybrans are what I like to call the "can do" faction. They have some odd units like the Cybran destroyer, which can sprout legs and crawl up onto land. And then there is the biggest and baddest unit of the whole faction, the giant monkeylord, an experimental unit. The Cybrans are a little trickier to learn than the UEF but are a lot of fun to play and have a cool and somewhat more ominous look to them.
Sometimes bigger really is better.
I think a good strategy while playing as the Cybrans is to master the use of the armored command unit (ACU) in frontline battles and how to properly use the stealth units. In other words, learn what each unit can do, and think of new strategies before you begin each game. "
"The Aeon are probably the hardest faction to master, and it has the most "out there" look. The cool thing about most of the assault units is that they can hover and get across bodies of water as well as land, which makes water maps a good choice for Aeon players. The galactic colossus usually makes an appearance and can devastate your opponent, but the thing to be careful of is antiair support, as the GC has no antiair defense systems. I think the Aeon are very powerful, and they can be underestimated in terms of their destructive capability."
"All three factions are very balanced at the lower tech levels. It's not until Tech 2 and Tech 3 that they start to diverge, and are completely different at Tech 4. I think both the Aeon and Cybran have the most devastating assault units for game-ending devastation, but the UEF's experimental nuclear artillery battery (the mavor) is pretty outrageous too, which makes them all equally good choices to learn and master."
Except......the T3 gunship doesnt have to go in "through the back door". It just kicks the front door in, says hi and begins to wreck shop.
That's just flat out wrong.....unless by "assault units" he means experimentals.
When the mavor is included in the same sentence, its likely.
